So much to say....

[rockangel]

I have so much I want to say. There is not enough room or time on here to go in to it all. I am really depressed. My husband and I are separated and I am feeling the tugs of my co-dependency pulling me down. He had been 8 months sober and had a slip. I told him for the 3rd or 4th time I wanted a divorce, but as always, my co-dependent brain took over and here we are, only separated, while he is supposedly "getting some type of help". I am miserable. Miss him deeply. Love him to death. We are in contact with each other daily. He says he has a plan for reuniting. Says he is going to give it to me in writing soon. Please help me with how to be with all of this. I am extremely depressed, can't keep my mind on anything. Can't be around people or do anything without crying. :21:

[Booky]

I have so much I want to say. There is not enough room or time on here to go in to it all. I am really depressed. My husband and I are separated and I am feeling the tugs of my co-dependency pulling me down. He had been 8 months sober and had a slip. I told him for the 3rd or 4th time I wanted a divorce, but as always, my co-dependent brain took over and here we are, only separated, while he is supposedly "getting some type of help". I am miserable. Miss him deeply. Love him to death. We are in contact with each other daily. He says he has a plan for reuniting. Says he is going to give it to me in writing soon. Please help me with how to be with all of this. I am extremely depressed, can't keep my mind on anything. Can't be around people or do anything without crying. :21:
:neutral: Are you truly certain that you really want the divorce?

If he was sober 8 months and now starting over again then that is not unusual because it is a hard addiction.

There are other fish out there but it is still just another fish.

Codependency is funny in many ways because what we think feels right is often based on some false feelings that comes out of the codependency.

Is it just a controlling "should"? like you think you "should" get a divorce - instead of you really NOT wanting to do it?

You two already have a relationship and he is trying to do right, then there must be some other thing telling you to dump the guy.

Some clever codependent person once said that we do not have relationships we have hostages.

So you love him and miss him and here he has a "slip" and you are thrown into an uproar, and you do have other options.

:162:

[rockangel]

Obviously I'm not sure I want a divorce. I was sure 3 weeks ago when he come home drunk and told me he was leaving to go ____ someone else. He has teetered back and forth for these 8 months letting me think that he is going to choose the booze/pot/whatever he is in to at the time. I assumed that when I told him I wanted a divorce that he would be all for it since he seemed like he wanted that unsober life again. He chose, only after I said divorce, to get the help he should have been getting all along.
I am seeing that I do have other options - like separation. How do I know that it is not going to take a divorce to get him sober once and for all though? Do I keep saying that is what I want each time he slips? At the time that is what I want, but I always assume he will agree. I never plan on him saying "I just slipped, I'll get more or different type of help". How many slips does it take for it to become a lifestyle?

[Booky]

Obviously I'm not sure I want a divorce. I was sure 3 weeks ago when he come home drunk and told me he was leaving to go ____ someone else. He has teetered back and forth for these 8 months letting me think that he is going to choose the booze/pot/whatever he is in to at the time. I assumed that when I told him I wanted a divorce that he would be all for it since he seemed like he wanted that unsober life again. He chose, only after I said divorce, to get the help he should have been getting all along.
I am seeing that I do have other options - like separation. How do I know that it is not going to take a divorce to get him sober once and for all though? Do I keep saying that is what I want each time he slips? At the time that is what I want, but I always assume he will agree. I never plan on him saying "I just slipped, I'll get more or different type of help". How many slips does it take for it to become a lifestyle?
:D What happened with me is that I use to talk and threaten "divorce" to my wife just because I was trying to control her actions. I had no real boundaries so when I said "divorce" then I did not really mean it - and my family of origin never took my words seriously either, and I was just trying to use the word "divorce" to control her out of fear. Now many years later I know it was really me that was living in fear of the divorce. But she did not have the same codependency that I had and she did not understand my words except that she figured I really did want a divorce from her and she took the threat personally as she figured I was serious and sincere about divorce and not about any controlling issues, and my words hurt my wife very much, and so she would go out without me and she eventually found another man and she was making serious plans for the upcoming divorce.

Me "crying wolf" (threatening divorce) over and over again and it backfired into my face. I loved my wife and I figured we were married for life, but I did not know how to express that love and so my attempts to control her screwed myself bigtime.

Other people believe what we say and not what we think we are saying.

We can not use our relationship to stop our mate's actions.

You can not use "divorce" as a way of stopping his drinking or pot or whatever.

You are trying to control his actions by punishing your self, and that is a typical codependent dysfunction.

What I would honestly suggest is that you back off of all your hostilities and try again to make the relationship better and leave the addictions or stopping the addictions as just his own business and not yours.

It is not a crime or a sin if the man gets drunk some times.

I live with the regrets that I destroyed my own young marriage (1981) instead of just being grateful for the blessing we did have at that time.

:sad:

[rockangel]

Thanks Booky - I partially agree with you. I have come to some realizations about my "threats" of divorce. But, honestly, when I come to the conclusion, at the time, a divorce is what I want. It is really not just a threat, at that specific time. Then, I look back and wonder. What happens is (and I'm sure this is typical) that my husband and I go through these cycles. In the middle of these cycles he starts slipping by placing himself in slippery places, substituting alcohol with pills and marijuanna, and during this time he has this attitude of "this is the way I am, live with it" or "this is how I was when you married me, I'm not changing" or "at least I'm not drunk and verbally abusing you" so, for a time I go through this feeling of "he has a problem and doesn't want to change". Based on these experiences with him as I see him slip deeper and deeper - the whole time just standing by knowing what is eventually going to happen - I come to the realization that he is not and doesn't want to change. So, when he finally falls and gets completely blitzed and starts the horrible, horrible verbal abuse - Yes, this makes me want a divorce. What other option do I have at the time? I'm thinking at that time, based on what he says during this cycle that we go through, that he wants a divorce too. Then, when I ask him for the divorce he says "I'll get help, I'll change, I don't like me this way either, I feel so much remorse, I'm so sorry, I don't know why I keep doing this" blah, blah.... What am I to do? Is he playing me? I truly don't expect this reaction from him, but it has happened every time. I think we have been through this "divorce" cycle 3 or 4 times in the last 2 years. Each time I take more finite and drastic steps towards it, always expecting him to tell me "ok, if this is want you want that's fine because I'm not going to change". Instead each time he gets more and more serious about changing and takes more serious steps towards changing. This time we are separated and he has joined an online AA group and has a sponser. He tells me that in a week or so he has planned to give me a plan of recovery in writing.

You say: "It is not a crime or a sin if the man gets drunk some times."

And I agree, but, to me (and I would have thought to any spouse of an alcoholic) this is only an indication that what ever it is he was doing to stay sober is not working. This is also a situation that equals me getting verbally abused. I can't just say, oh well, he just got drunk, haha, and blow it off. There is much more to it than that.

[Booky]

:neutral: I agree with everything you said and you do seem to have a real sincere approach to your marriage and its problems.

So aside from all else then I say your husband is a fortunate man in many ways.

Why not try some middle ground? instead of borderline all or nothing.

Like instead of threatening divorce take a more aggressive and imediate approach like if he drinks then you sleep on the couch, or in the kids room, or if he gets verbally abusive.

Or even cut out dinner and tell him to fix his own saying "if you can get drunk or talk crap to me then surely you can fix your own grub."

The threat of divorce is like saying I am going to punish you tomorrow or some time later and what a person needs is the direct and imediate consiquences.

In extreme cases then leave the house or stay with your family for a night till he sobers up or apologizes.

And never NEVER argue with an abuser or a drunk. Say things short, direct and to the point and no more. No arguing and no discussion and talk when he calms down or gets sober.

Those are healthy boundary ideas because it keeps the relationship functioning.

My wife (long ago ex-wife) once told me to go sleep on the couch and then I refused so she went to sleep on the couch and that blew my mind big time and it never happened again.

:blush:

[Booky]

:24: And a second thought is that I also recommend the old silent treatment against him.

If some one sees that as foolish or childish then that can only be because they never did it or saw it done because the silent treatment is a truly mean, nasty and powerful thing to do.

I was once in a group housing with five other guys (4 and me as 5) and one guy threatened and pissed me off so I did the silent treatment to him for 5 days and everybody else in the place knew about the hostility, and like at meal time I might pass him the salt or some thing but no eye contact and if I had to speak to him then I only said one or two words with obvious contempt. After it was done and I stopped the treatment then he said it lasted for 12 days so 5 days must have felt like 12 to him, and the whole group was affected by the dispute because my long silent treatment turned it into a BIG deal.

Another time my 31 year old son living in my place took (stole) some $80 out of my pocket when I was asleep, and he went out with his friends to drink up the money, then next day morning he pretends he did nothing and knew nothing about it. So I sat there with him without saying much of a word all day and I was so angry at him and I wanted more then him to lie out of it. That started as a silent treatment and it messed up his devious plan because it never gave him the chance to lie about it since he could not say he knew the money was stolen as I made him sweat the lie out. But that hostility never really ended because I knew that I could never trust him again, and later I did put some fear into him about taking things but there is no happy ending on that one.

So I say the silent treatment is very effective and it only takes one person to do it (personal boundary) and it really is a mean and hostile yet powerful thing to do to any person.

:eek:

[rockangel]

Booky,

I just want to say thank you for such open-minded non-judgmental comments you have made to me. I really really need this type of support. Not only am I going through my separation from my verbally abusive alcoholic husband, but as I have searched the sites available on the subject I have run in to a site where I was attacked with very very negative posts from several of the members. It has been a completely unbelievable experience.

Again - Thanks!

[Booky]

Booky,

I just want to say thank you for such open-minded non-judgmental comments you have made to me. I really really need this type of support. Not only am I going through my separation from my verbally abusive alcoholic husband, but as I have searched the sites available on the subject I have run in to a site where I was attacked with very very negative posts from several of the members. It has been a completely unbelievable experience.

Again - Thanks!
:17: You are very welcome, and I am happy about helping even when I myself can not see how I did it.

I have had some negative experiences on Forums too and I see many people getting the fact mixed up that the people posting are not Doctors and often people can be honestly wrong or even severely dysfunctional, so we need to be more highly aware that what other posters print are just words unless we make them more than words our selves.

People on some sites call me names and ugly criticisms and I let it all bounce off or I try to nicely tell them of the problem, but when I say some thing off the wall then many other posters get crazy angry and offended and defensive.

I got booted off of one Forum because I told a woman to work it out with her husband and try not to get a divorce and it created 10 pages of cut-downs and me getting the boot.

This Cyber Forum here is okay and I like the info available here, but a more busy codependency Forum is at Daily Strength Board link HERE (http://dailystrength.org/c/Codependency/support-group), and I am Booky over there too.

:12: