About to go to my first meeting.

[psylence]

I almost have the courage to go to NA meeting. I have gone before with my mother ( a fellow opiate addict, now dead from suicide). I went with her as support when I was very young (before I started using).

I remember the meeting being very "God" centered. If you read my first posts, you will see that I am an Atheist. My issue is that I am really concerned I will not be able to endure the talk of God and the prayer.

Does anyone have any advice or experience with this and how I may be able to handle this.

See, whenever anyone is speaking to me (no matter the topic) as soon as God and prayer comes up, my mind shuts off 100%. I know I need the help, but I am almost certain once the religious talk starts, I may walk out.

I don't know what to do....

[Victoriana]

Firstly, A resounding Well Done!
When I went to my first meeting I was terrified. I'm so glad I made it though.
In the steps and traditions it does say "God, as we understand him". Many of the people attending use the words Higher Power and God to mean things like self respect or whatever works for them. Find your own Higher Power. It works for those that don't wish to embrace God.
You know, this sounds strange even to me but I am so darn Proud of you! I have watched your struggle through your posts and you haven't given up. Keep going. We are all behind you.

[psylence]

I thought there were quite a few good responses to your other thread. I had a big issue with organised religion until about the age of 27, though I didn't rule out having a general sense of spirituality. I'd walk out on things too and get very angry, because I despised 'dogmatism'. (I'd moved to a community which was very Christian influenced, and at first I sought to avoid them like the plague.) Funny thing is that one speaker I walked out on I later became personal friends with.

I'd advise you to not make up your mind immediately about people - often those people whom I thought were dogmatic, once I got to know them better, turned out to be decent people and their hearts were in the right place. I became a Christian myself in my late twenties - a bit ironic I suppose because I dumped my first boyfriend in disgust when he became a Christian. I'm sorry if this is not expressing it well but all I can really give you is my own experience. (I'm going to my first AA meeting in a few months in two days time BTW.)

I thank you for your response. My issue with the 12 steps is that the references of the "higher power" quote the idea of "Him" as the higher power. This to me shows a preference and almost requirement to accept a patriarchal and monotheistic idea of god. This would be in line with Jewish,Christian or Islamic traditions. What if your "spirituality or "your own idea of God" does not involve a monotheistic god, then how do you deal with the "Him" aspect. What about Hindus, Buddhists, Taoists, Gnostics, Shintos, Pagans, etc,etc?

If I am to surrender myself to an idea, I need to understand it fully.


I am sorry for all the difficult questions , please don't give up on me yet. I am trying, but these issues are weigh heavy on my mind.

[zoomie]

I think some one wrote in an earlier post that right now drugs are your higher power. So in turn you could make a medical reason to stop getting high as your higher power. Your going to get sick taking all those pills if you have not already. I'm not much of a God person,but I have respect for myself and other people not to walk out on people who do believe. Some where some how, they must be doing something right because they are clean and you are not. Stop using your head so much to think about things to death. Your only thinking yourself into an early grave. In your heart you know your wrong doing pills, you know that your addicted. I do believe Love is what people find in the rooms and that is what helps them get sober and clean. They find love and acceptance from what they believe as God's love or find love from another human in form of a handshake or a hug. Nothing wrong with love and acceptance, that is what you found here. You found people willing to listion to you, to cheer you on, to pat you on the back, now I'm sort of smacking you to get your butt to a meeting and just listion to how people got sober minus the God part. Listion with an open heart and shut your mind off. Like I said I'm not much of a God person,but I like hanging with the people who do believe because they are nice and do not mean any harm. Just like how you come here seeking help from a christian forum. It's safe here and no one is pushing God down your throat. You need to develope tollerance of people who will try though. Your saving your ass and I'm sure you can put up with a little "god" in order to do that. When you go to a meeting and once you are clean of any substance, you can raise your hand and bring up the subject about being a nonbeliever and how to go about working the steps that way. The steps are just suggestions on how to live your life so you will not pick up again. If you lie you feel guilt. The steps teach us not to lie in order not to feel guilt there save us from drinking or drugging over guilt. It's as simple as that. Like I said don't over think things and you'll do just fine.

[psylence]

I think some one wrote in an earlier post that right now drugs are your higher power. So in turn you could make a medical reason to stop getting high as your higher power. Your going to get sick taking all those pills if you have not already. I'm not much of a God person,but I have respect for myself and other people not to walk out on people who do believe. Some where some how, they must be doing something right because they are clean and you are not. Stop using your head so much to think about things to death. Your only thinking yourself into an early grave. In your heart you know your wrong doing pills, you know that your addicted. I do believe Love is what people find in the rooms and that is what helps them get sober and clean. They find love and acceptance from what they believe as God's love or find love from another human in form of a handshake or a hug. Nothing wrong with love and acceptance, that is what you found here. You found people willing to listion to you, to cheer you on, to pat you on the back, now I'm sort of smacking you to get your butt to a meeting and just listion to how people got sober minus the God part. Listion with an open heart and shut your mind off. Like I said I'm not much of a God person,but I like hanging with the people who do believe because they are nice and do not mean any harm. Just like how you come here seeking help from a christian forum. It's safe here and no one is pushing God down your throat. You need to develope tollerance of people who will try though. Your saving your ass and I'm sure you can put up with a little "god" in order to do that. When you go to a meeting and once you are clean of any substance, you can raise your hand and bring up the subject about being a nonbeliever and how to go about working the steps that way. The steps are just suggestions on how to live your life so you will not pick up again. If you lie you feel guilt. The steps teach us not to lie in order not to feel guilt there save us from drinking or drugging over guilt. It's as simple as that. Like I said don't over think things and you'll do just fine.

You hit the nail on the head. I over analyze and think way too much. I may even be using the "fear of God talk" as an excuse to deal with the fear of going. I mean here in the internet, its not face to face, which is so much easier.

I am scared to go, and look someone in the eyes and them "know" I am an addict.

I am coming around and these forums are really helping me learn a lot about myself as well as the acceptance i hope to receive from an NA meeting.

Now to take the leap.

[Chewi]

In ANY group of people you get together with, even your friends, there are going to be things said that "offend" you (my mother always reminds me that you have to TAKE offence) or that you disagree with. One thing I firmly believe about meetings is that "you take what you need and leave the rest." Meaning you use what works to keep you clean/sober and you don't dwell on the rest of it, just let it go. You may even "need" it later, but just not now. What you are in the meeting for is people's experience, strength, hope. You get to see where people were at and where they are now, so that you can see sobriety CAN be done and is done by millions every day. You get to see how they do it. I happen to be a Christian, but I still had an alcohol problem, so I needed the experience, strength, hope of other people to show me the way to sobriety.
The other thread really does have some good points about the higher power, and many have used them. Just think of your higher power as "clean living" or "good health" or "being a better, kind person" or whatever concept gives you a picture of what you strive for. I think you will find in meetings that there are many different concepts of higher power. You also have to remain open minded to allow others to believe what they believe.
I hope this helps. Clean and sober living really is better! It is something I am grateful for daily!

[zoomie]

When I relaps for a number of years I was afraid to go back to AA. I was afraid of rejection and of someone calling me a relapser (which I was). I went anyway to save my ass. Nothing happened except people saying welcome back. When I thought of going back to school at my age (45), I was afraid of being too old or not smart enough. I just graduated with honors of all things. I just went ahead and sign up and dove in. I have lots of fears,but I usally just dive in to what ever situation I have fear of. One time when i was young I was surfing. Nice little waves at first,then they turned into big waves. I had to keep swimming past them to not get muched by a big wave. I was getting tired and losing my strenghth (sorry for the miss spelling) and the only way for me to get back to shore was to let one of the waves take me in without my board. I was so afraid of getting killed,but I took the next big wave in. I ate sand and got all scraped up and was underwater for a bit,but my body hit the shore and I knew I was safe. I had a healthy respect of the water after that and did't do much surfing when the waves where big,but I faced my fear and lived. There was no one out there to save me during that time I was far away fromt he life guards and other people. I just trusted that I would get to shore one way or another hurt or unhurt. We all have fears, some real and some not. But to save our lives we must face our fears or die. When you go to a meeting you do not have to say a thing. Just remember those people are there too for the same reason and they will not pass judgment. Some will be poor,some rich, some smelly, some recovered and some struggling. Don't lend any money out and try to get a sponcer who will show you the ropes. A person with a year or more of clean time will do.

[Chewi]

It seems, Psylence, as if you are thinking things through and beginning to understand your problem with pills--getting to that first meeting ususally does cause a great deal of stress for us, but you will see that you will be helped and not judged because you will be with your peers. There will be nothing you can say in a meeting that will shock or surprise anyone. What you will find is that you are not alone and that there is a lot of experience, strength, hope! Best of luck to you and have a great day!

[sarahjane78]

I am athiest aswell, as religion was heavily pushed on me as a child. Being as how i camem into this world, and endured much suffering at the hands of WHO KNOWS, WHO. I desided that "god" if there was one, let me go through more that I could handle, In my 30s now, I have started reading everything I can. Alot of what I find I can relate to is the L.Ron. Hubbard ideals and beliefs in scientology. Your higher power is yourself, your mind...and being in control. Opiates, weren't my drug of choice, so I can't say how you much feel. Recently I gave up my addiction to marijuana, prior to that I gave up crack, which literally let me unrecognizable to myself, and anyone who knew me. I to get uncomfortable when the topic of "god" "jesus" and religion in general. I believe I am my own higher power. I am the one who wants and needs me to have faith. IN MY SELF, for really I think thats what my addiction was about, NOT believe I had more potential. which i see now, was a fallacy. I am stronger now, and willing to accept all walks of life, no matter the race, religion, believes and or ideals. we all sing our own song, and write our own story, its up to you now, to find your "next chapter"

Believe in you, and the powers you possess. You will be surprise how truly powerful you are.

....

[Victoriana]

We are none of us here to expound our beliefs. We all have to find the Higher Power that works for us. For those of us that believe in God, then we hold onto Him and let Him support us on our journey. For those of us that don't believe in God, we find another Higher Power to support us. Either way will work as long as we keep our goal of "clean and sober" in sight.

[DaveH]

psylence,
My very best efforts brought me into the rooms of AA. There I found hope and a new way of thinking, acting, and processing. The point I want to make is that I could not provide a way out....I had failed miserably at being my own higher power. It will matter little to most in those rooms whom or what you choose as a higher power. Quite honestly I am one today who does believe in the triune God of my youth, but my understanding of who He is has changed. I tell you that, so I can tell you this; I would not be offended if your concept of a higher power is different than mine. Espousing Atheism, Buddhism, Judaism, etc. is not what the program is about. Accepting that there is something greater than my power was necessary for me. Getting clean and/or sober and learning to live that way is why I came into the rooms. When someone talks about a HP that differs from mine, and they are free and sober, I am happy for them. I leave it to a Power Greater than Me to sort all the other stuff out. Best wishes as you start your journey.
Regards,
DaveH

[sarahjane78]

We are none of us here to expound our beliefs. We all have to find the Higher Power that works for us. For those of us that believe in God, then we hold onto Him and let Him support us on our journey. For those of us that don't believe in God, we find another Higher Power to support us. Either way will work as long as we keep our goal of "clean and sober" in sight.


I sure hope, my post wasn't read in a way that promoted any one type or form or religion. I have catholics, christians, mormons, johovas, and budhists in my family, and my hand selected family. I love them all for their beliefs. I learn new principles from each one of them. granted I do not go to church, nor read a bible at night, at times i find myself in prayer. and at other times i meditate. I was simply trying to let "psylence" no there is so much more to religion, and so many avenues out there. that there is bound to be one that will find for him, in his time of need.

as I ended, that my higher power comes from within me. and to believe in himself.

Either way, sorry if i offened anyone, that isn't ever my intentions.
:smile:

[Victoriana]

LOL, no offence taken. I was merely explaining how it works.

[psylence]

so is this

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/09/08/BA99S1AKQ.DTL

[psylence]

There are other types of recovery, psylence, and I posted them on your other thread - some are completely secular. I don't think that AA is for everyone and that people should be free to choose. In recovery, it doesn't matter to me personally which beliefs a person has, and there is freedom of interpretation in the 12 steps. I hope it didn't come across as if I was expounding my beliefs either. Just I had 100% intolerance against all faiths when I was younger, it excluded me from many things, and I sort of regret that now.


I have been checking out SMART
http://www.smartrecovery.org/intro/index.htm

I will see what they are about. But, I am really starting to think people can just quit and be done with it.

I have been talking to some of the people in my life that had drug problems all just quit and never used again. No A.A., N.A., therapy, programs, etc.

It was all just a matter self control and will power.

[flick]

The newcomer only really needs to know that there is no religious requirement for AA attendance and that he is free to believe whatever he chooses to believe.

There are many agnostics and atheists in AA (http://www.primenet.com/%7Ejmassie/wagslist.htm) as well as many members of established churches and organized religions, Christian and otherwise. The Third Tradition of AA states that "The only requirement for AA membership is a desire to stop drinking." Nothing is said about religion – or about any other requirement.

What then about all the talk of God and even the Lord's Prayer that is said at many –not all- AA meetings? The basic idea is to attempt to relate to some kind of "power greater than oneself." The reason for this "Higher Power" is to acquire a sense of perspective and also support. Many people say that they use the AA group or AA as a whole in this fashion. The Eleventh Step speaks of "God as we understand Him," a qualification that leaves ample room for personal preferences. AA members are free to believe anything they like about God, up to and including his non-existence.

It is commonly said that AA is "spiritual, not religious." The goal is direct personal spiritual growth without what many see as the unnecessary and even harmful encumbrances of organized religion. In this respect AA reveals its Protestant roots and dislike of the trappings and hierarchy of organized religion.

Many people familiar with the challenges facing newcomers to AA suggest that the whole topic of God, religion and spirituality be reserved for a later and more suitable time in recovery. Excessive attention to and analysis of this or any other abstract subject is seldom useful and may in fact frequently prove harmful to recovery. Such theoretical or philosophical concerns early in recovery from alcoholism are often manifestations of the addictive process itself, or of the afflicted individual's alienation from his own core self and feelings into an over-intellectualized state where he feels comfortable and safe.

The important thing is to "keep coming back" to meetings and to have as open a mind as possible.

personally, I feel it is a little sad that you are not prepared to give AA or N/A a go but appear to be willing to come here and find all the reasons not to attend. Many, many people have benefited over the years; no matter what negative reading you may find about AA;....."it works IF YOU WORK IT" and there is a lot of positive proof of this!!!

Good luck anyway with whatever path you choose.